Ali Habashi: So let’s kick this off by talking about LivNow. Can you give us a bit of background about how the concept came about and how you’re helping families today?

Maureen Longoria: Sure I’d be happy to. So my entire management team, as well as myself, spent our careers in corporate relocation.

And then at one point in time I went to work at a company that was providing some real estate assistance to older adults that were moving into senior living communities. And when we would be visiting these communities and meeting with prospective residents for the community, we would sit down with them and ask them what their concerns were about making that move.

Because you could tell they wanted to make the move. They wanted to stop worrying about taking care of their home. They wanted to stop having to make meals for themselves. They wanted to make new friends. They wanted to have activities provided. Everything that the community offered was something that they wanted, but there was something stopping them.

And when we got talking with them, we realized it was that transition process of going from their home to the community that was stopping them many times for a couple reasons. One, they were gonna have to downsize in order to make that move because they were generally moving into a much smaller space.

And two, they didn’t even know where to begin to physically manage this move. And then three, they didn’t really know how to even go about picking suppliers anymore. Many of them hadn’t moved in 20, 30, 40, sometimes it’s been 50 years since they’ve moved. So in talking with them, we realized what was stopping them from living their best lives (hence LivNow) was their fear over making that transition to the community.

We said with all of our relocation experience, we can make this happen for them. We can make this work for them, we can be there to support them, and make that transition, as smooth as possible. And hence LivNow was formed.

Ali: Sounds good. So it came out of a real need.

Maureen: A thousand percent, and it continues to be a real need.

Because even those people that are fortunate enough to have adult children, that might be able to help them, many times they’re not living anywhere near them. Or even if they are, they have full-time jobs. They have their own kids, they don’t have the bandwidth to manage this transition for their loved one.

And there’s a lot that goes into it, just that downsizing process, going through the things and giving things away to charitable organizations. Throwing things in a landfill if need be. Selling things, maybe things that have value that won’t go with them.

All of that–figuring out what should go with what shouldn’t–that’s a lot. When you move for a job, literally the movers come in and pack up everything in your house, including the garbage in your garbage can, and take it to the new location. When you’re moving into a senior living community, it’s going to be, for most people, the most emotionally and logistically overwhelming move of their life.

Because of that downsizing, because they’re stepping away from many people, a home they lived in for a long time. Many have raised families there. And so there’s the emotional aspects of letting go as well as logistically having to let go and do something with all of those belongings.

So it’s a super challenging, super unique move for people. And the other thing that makes it unique is it’s usually a local move. It’s usually within a five mile radius. And people might know the name of a mover or whatnot, but they don’t know how to vet one, and they don’t know what’s a fair price to pay and all of that.

So, that’s where we come into play, in supporting them with that and then just giving that adult child that peace of mind. A break so they don’t have to be the ones responsible for coordinating that. A really interesting statistic most people don’t realize is that the amount of people aging solo, which means no kids or spouse, is gonna quadruple in the next ten years to over 8 million. Actually in less than ten years, it’ll be over 8 million.

That means they don’t have an adult child to lean on, or it’s not them and their spouse making this move. So now they’re doing it on their own. Well, first of all, they need that community more than anybody because. They need to be around people. It’s good for them. It will extend their life, it’ll extend their health.

In addition, they need the support to be able to get to that community then too.

Ali: Yeah, I mean, I think Homethrive was born out of the same sort of need that we saw, especially towards caregivers. It’s interesting the fact that there’s going to be a lot of people with no caregiver. It’s just going to be themselves trying to manage everything.

And I know we have similar statistics about how many in the aging population versus how many caregivers there are going to be in the future. And just the discrepancy between those two numbers is just going to get wider and wider. So I’m glad that our services exist. I’m glad that there’s a few more benefits and a few more support systems that they can lean on to.

So you mentioned this, and I don’t need to tell you how many people want to age in place at home, oftentimes in a family home that maybe they’ve spent a good portion of their life, an important portion of their life, in. So if I am a caregiver, if I’m a child of aging parents, how do I begin to speak to them about downsizing, especially when those old family homes begin to become unmanageable or worse, a hazard for their health?

Maureen: Yeah, that’s a great question and it is a tricky situation for sure. Everything about it is tricky. There’s a couple of things.

The one piece of advice I always give though, and I put this on LinkedIn once and it just blew up, is that if you are an adult child or loved one, when they want to give you things, take it. Take whatever they wanna give you, because you know the reason they’re holding on is because they’re afraid it’s just gonna go in a landfill.

And it’s a lot easier for them to start downsizing if they know that they’re giving it to someone that they love, that can keep that memory going for them.

So when you want to start talking to them about this stuff, I highly recommend just having that conversation: “Hey, you know what? Let’s work on this together. You’ve got a lot of stuff here, and I want to make sure that we preserve the things that you want to preserve, or send stuff to get repurposed. There’s so many families these days that really need things. They’re in new homes and they need to furnish these new homes. Let’s do this together.”

That’s one way to start. One room at a time. And again, if you have a loved one that wants to start handing you things to take, take it. It doesn’t matter what you do with it later, they can let go if they know that you are going to take it and care for it. They’re passing that memory on.

Because that’s what’s stopping them. It’s the memories associated with those things that really stop them from letting go of it. But if they give it to you, who they love, then that memory continues on for them.

So an easy way to do it is just to say, “Hey, let’s do this together so you can help me make decisions. I know there’s some things you want me to keep, mom, and I know there’s some things that we could repurpose. I know there’s families that could really use these things. So how about we start with this room.”

It’s just a great way to get that going. Another thing you can do is introduce them to the idea of having an outside professional come in. Most people don’t realize there’s these people called senior move managers, and this is what they do.

They help families organize and downsize to make that move to a community or even continue to age in place. So maybe they’d go up in that attic and they’ll pull things down and you are making all the decisions, they’re just helping you sort through it, and they’re kind of removing the emotions from it.

Because they’re not emotionally attached to it, that person is. And so you can hire these people that come in and can help you as well, and can help your loved one. So you can say, “You know what, mom, here’s what I’d love to do. I know you don’t want me to have to do all this. You know when the time comes and you’re gone. Let’s get at it now and, and let’s keep the things that are important to you to keep Let me take the things that you want me to have and then let’s repurpose this stuff.”

“And there’s a thing called a senior move manager and we can hire them to come in and help us so I’m not spending weeks going through this stuff. They can help us sort through this stuff.”

That’s another way to do it is to bring in an outside resource, especially if there’s friction between you and that loved one. Most loved ones, older adults, are open to that idea because they know and they don’t want to leave you the burden of having to go through all of that anyhow.

Really the conversation gets to be around safety too. Yeah, let’s get into the attic and get that stuff down, but also let’s make sure you’re safe. You have enough room to move around. There’s no tripping hazards here. You know, things like that. So I think that those are just some ideas to start having that conversation.

The holidays, strangely enough, are a great time for them to start repurposing things. If they have China, or silver or things like this that they know they want to be giving to their nieces, nephews, grandchildren.

“Hey, mom, at the holidays, I know you know you really would love them to have it. Why don’t we give that to them now? Or why don’t you make your famous holiday cookies, put them on that platter, and then we’ll package it up, put a nice bow on it, and send it to Susie and let her keep that platter.”

Do you know what I mean? There’s just so many creative ways in which you can have those conversations and slowly but surely start to move those things out, and help with that downsizing. And it’s just really getting a little bit creative about those conversations, but really empathetic and thoughtful. And if you can’t have those conversations in an empathetic and thoughtful way, which I completely appreciate and understand because sometimes there’s friction, that’s a great time to introduce the idea of a senior move manager who can come in, look at the house and say, here are my recommendations to make sure that you’re living in the safest environment for yourself. If you want to continue to age at home, here’s other things I can help you with, and they’re well-versed in having these conversations.

So those are just some of the ways you can start having those conversations with them.

Ali: That third, sort of neutral party. You are not the first person who has mentioned that to me on one of these episodes. The last person to mention something like that was our guest, Consuela, who is a fall safety expert.

So she was recommending occupational therapists come in and check out the home of any aging parents, especially once someone has already fallen. To sort of make the environment a little safer. And because they’re a neutral party, if they say, “Oh, you know, we should probably do this.”

It’s not like your child is saying that to you and it’s a little less condescending. It’s like an expert coming in.

Maureen: One thousand percent. That’s why those senior move managers can be so helpful. They just look at them completely differently than they would their adult child.

Ali: It’s a little bit more like even ground. But, okay. Speaking of downsizing, so we’ve spoken about what we should do to start that move, but once it’s already happened, what are the options for seniors looking to downsize? Like, what are the community options where they can move into? And maybe if we can get into some of the requirements of those places and the benefits once they’re in.

Maureen: Sure. Sure. And one thing I also want to mention, there’s a great book out there called Keep the Memories, Lose the Stuff. It was written by Matt Paxton. He’s the leading authority on downsizing, hoarders, estate settlement sort of stuff. If you’re looking for a great way to support your parent, that’s a great book.

You can find it on Amazon. It’s like $14. And it gives you a list of resources to donate things to. So that’s a great book. If you really want to approach that subject with your parent, read that ahead of time too, because it really talks about the importance of those memories and how to deal with your loved ones.

But so there’s different types of communities that they can be moving into depending on the level of care that you need. Hopefully they’re in a place where they’re going to go in as independent living, meaning they don’t need any regular care. They would go in as independent living.

So then they can look at active adult communities, which are really for people that aren’t looking to have those meals, and aren’t looking to have other resources on onsite. It’s more of a lifestyle choice, right? When you think active adult, you think 55 plus, that’s a lifestyle choice.

You want to be around people that are like you looking for that same sort of lifestyle. There’s tons of activities. It’s all about that experience. So that’s one option for you. Then there’s also other rental communities and active adult is generally a rental community. There’s other independent living rental communities some of them will offer meals and maybe a little bit more options for care.

And a lot of these, independent living communities then might also offer a continuum of care, which you could stay there. Maybe if you need to move into assisted living or if you need to move into skilled nursing or memory care, they might offer those options as well.

Those are all rental options. There’s another category of communities called Life Plan Communities or CRCs, Continuing Care Retirement Communities. Those are entrance fee-based communities. And once you move in, you pay your monthly fees. Like you would a rental. But then usually they cap off the fees and they’re not going to go any higher because you put down that large entrance fee when you went in there. And you stay there for the rest of your life and can move through the continuum of care, whether you need memory care or skilled nursing.

So those are the different types of communities now, depending on the sort of care that you need. Somebody might be struggling with Alzheimer’s, then they’re looking at a memory care community, or somebody maybe now really needs some help on a regular basis. Then they’re looking at assisted living communities.

And then when you’re talking about rent, memory care, assisted living, generally speaking, you’re going into a rental situation there. Now when we move people into those communities, assisted living memory care, generally the spaces are a little bit smaller and what we find is we have to move them pretty quickly.

Like all of a sudden the family’s like, no, we need to get mom into memory care. She was found wandering or whatever it is, right? So that’s where we come in and they’ll determine the couple of things that they’re going to take with the really precious memory things, things like that.

We’ll get those moved over to the community for her, and in those situations we help the family clean out the house and then get it on the market and get it sold. So that looks a little bit different now. If they’re moving into independent living, then usually the seniors are very much involved with choosing what they’re going to take with.

Those senior move managers can actually draw out a floor plan for them so they can figure what furniture will fit in there. Then you go through the process of sending things to charitable groups for repurposing.

There’s things that are always going to go to the garbage dump and getting that all taken care of and getting the house on the market. So it just depends on what level of care do they need, that will determine what kind of community they’re going to go into. And then, depending on what kind of community they’re going to go into really determines how does that process work for them.

Ali: Now I do want to ask one thing. I mean, I know we’ve covered how to start again, the process of downsizing by maybe getting rid of that platter along with the cookies or maybe like sending some China to one of the siblings. But I can only imagine once you move from maybe a family home to one of these communities that the downsizing is going to blow up a little bit more like as far as clutter goes.

The last time I made a significant move, I’d lived in a place for five years. I had four housemates there, so a lot of the furniture was communal, it wasn’t mine, I wasn’t going to take it. So I didn’t have a ton to move. I essentially had my room. But then I thought I didn’t have a ton that I needed to move, and then I started to pack up and it was just more and more and more and more stuff.

It just kind of comes out of the woodwork. Even when you think you’re packed, you’re not. So if you’ve been living in a family home for more than five years, how do you just deal with the sheer amount of things, and I know you’ve mentioned that book. But are there more tips and tricks that you can tell us for when we’re making that transition or when a family member’s making that transition between family home and their senior living community, whichever one they’re bound for.

Maureen: So as much as we try to tell them when we speak at the different communities to the prospects, start today, more often than not, they don’t. But that’s where that senior move manager really comes in, Ali. That senior move manager comes in with a team of people and we can literally have the downsizing done in a week’s time.

They come in together with the older adult, they determine what are they taking with, what are those really special memories? What can fit in the community? In these senior move managers, this is what they specialize in. They can help them understand. You don’t need to bring two sets of dishes.

You’re going to be eating meals at the community. You’re not going to be cooking like that anymore. You don’t need to bring all those baking things. How about bring one cookie tray, that sort of thing. So they are experts in helping them understand what they should be bringing with and what there really is not room for.

But more importantly, they don’t need to bring a big tool set. There’s lots of things that you don’t think of that you just don’t need to bring anymore. And then they will literally take those things to those charitable organizations.

Or they can help you arrange to have your furniture picked up that you’re not taking with, so it goes to a furniture bank. They have all those resources at their fingertips and can do that. Now, can the adult children do that? We did that for my mom. It’s a lot of work. My mom has four daughters.

She was very fortunate we had type A personalities, but we worked our fingers to the bone for a couple months. It was a really big project. Whereas when you have the senior move managers come in, they can bring in a team of 2, 3, 4 people and have that done in no time flat. If the timeframe is a week, they’ll get it done in a week, and they know exactly where to donate things.

They know exactly what’s of value and can help you determine if you want to sell something, how to go about it to sell that in the best way possible. And, again, going back to your point about removing the emotion of it, it really then gets down to, okay, let’s focus on your new home.

What do you want to take there? Let’s go ahead and let somebody else enjoy these things now.

Ali: I can only imagine too that whatever sort of bias or hesitancy that maybe an aging couple or an aging individual has with their own stuff is probably duplicated at the very least a little bit by their children.

Because that stuff belongs to their parents. It might have touched the children’s lives at some point or another. Maybe you’ve seen China in the same cupboard for the last 30 years every time you visited. So it’s again, that neutral party coming in with the point of you do not need this unless somebody wants to take it who’s in the family.

Then you’ll be all set with your cookie platters and your toolboxes once you get to the senior community.

Maureen: Yeah, seriously. 1000% because then the emotion is completely removed, but they’re sensitive to the fact that, it’s kind of like I always say when I do downsizing presentations, look around, look around your family room because you’re going to have to declutter it to put your house on the market.

I mean, the millennial group, they don’t wanna see stuff and they want it depersonalized. So I always say, look around at what sparks joy for you? Look on your bookshelves, look in your cabinet. If it doesn’t spark joy, you do get rid of it. 

Ali: Marie Kondo method.

Maureen: Totally. Totally. So I do these downsizing presentations at the communities all the time for prospects, and I’m like, start now. And here’s where you start, and look around because you know, I tell them if the time comes and you have to put your house on the market, you’re going to have to get rid of all that stuff anyhow.

So figure out what are those things that really do spark joy for you and plan to take those, but in the meantime, go ahead and start getting rid of those things that don’t right now and start cleaning out the clutter. Especially because so many times when we’re working with people, they say, “I’m not moving for a couple years,” we hear that all the time.

It’s like. Okay, but what are you waiting for? You’re 88 years old and this is a resort lifestyle community. What are you waiting for? But you know what they’re waiting for? They’re waiting for the inertia to do it and somebody to give them the ideas. And like I said, just that push to start doing that.

One of my favorite things is I always ask who’s sitting with bins of pictures or boxes of pictures? Everybody is, and I’m like, are you enjoying those pictures? I’m like, no. I’m like, exactly. So if you want to start somewhere, that’s the best place to start. Grab those bins or boxes of pictures and while you’re sitting on the couch watching Netflix, start culling them.

Start going through. And if it’s the same picture with four different smiles or something, save the one. How many of us have duplicates? Because at the time everybody got duplicates back then, right? Start culling the pictures. If it’s just a landscape, whatever, and if it’s one that really makes you stop and pause, put it to the side.

You can create a photo album of up to a hundred pictures. Then you have a real photo album with your favorite pictures, the ones you went through. So you’re going to toss probably two thirds of these pictures easily, when it all gets done, between the duplicates, the landscapes, the same picture six different ways.

After you finished culling them, use a digital solution to upload those pictures. Then you can buy a scanner, you can digitize them yourself. There’s apps on the phone you can use to digitize them or there’s companies that can help you digitize these things and you just mail it to the company, or there’s always a local one too that you can bring your pictures to and they’ll digitize it for you.

Now that you digitized them, treat yourself to one of those beautiful picture frames where you upload your pictures and guess what? Put it in your family room or wherever you sit the most, your kitchen, wherever it is, put it in there. And now guess what? You are looking at your pictures. 

They’re just moving one after another and now you’re enjoying your pictures again. And I explain to them, your grandchild that’s spending some time in Madrid without you even realizing they’re uploading, they can upload pictures to you and you can see pictures of them in Madrid like this.

If I give you no other piece of advice, I always tell you to do this. It’s the easiest thing to do and now you’re enjoying your pictures, and you can start sharing them. Maybe you had friends that you traveled with all the time, and once you digitize them, then you can send that to them as well.

Or you can create a little video of them and send that to them. Or you can have them over and then play a little video with all those vacation pictures you all had? So if I have one piece of advice, it’s at least start there. I know things have meaning to them, but it’s those pictures that are the hardest things and digitizing them preserves them for a lifetime.

And then you don’t have those physical boxes that are never opened and never looked at full of pictures.

Ali: I like that idea. And I forgot they used to give you duplicates of all photos, I forgot. And of course half of them, before digital photos, before you could see your picture immediately, you were just sort of flying by the seat of your pants.

So half of your roll had been exposed to light or something and destroyed. So all these totally nonsense photos. Your dad got ahold of your camera and zoomed in too close to the ocean. Now it’s just a gray square.

Maureen: And you didn’t throw those out when you got them? Why? Why didn’t we throw them out then?

Ali: But we didn’t. But now’s the time.

Maureen: Now’s the time.